Remember: just because someone has trudged around this deceptively cute looking internet quagmire for awhile to finally be described with the humble title of 'long-standing member' by someone else who is a legitimate witness, and is a dedicated person who also stuck around to wait for the right moments to speak and opinionate when they choose, to eventually convince people that they generally are good at writing at times something clever, insightful or witty, does not make them the more right about every little detail or discussion they decide to get involved with.
No, but it does mean that long-standing poster has had the time to earn the respect and trust of others in the community, that their words are strongly considered for whatever merit people here feel they have, and that posters have had a long time to consider and digest those words. That is not elitism, it's simple respect that is earned over time. Newbies who throw their weight around from the get-go and act haughty and condescending with opinions that have been digested repeatedly over the decades and ultimately rejected by the consensus a long time ago are not going to earn respect, nor come off as intellectually impressive with something new to add no matter how intelligent and articulate they may obviously be. That being the case, I wish you luck with convincing us to lose the respect for kids that we have in favor of downgrading paternalism.
This is to let you know that your condescending antagonism, from a person who has yet to earn the trust and respect from others here, is not going to work in your favor.
You can fool all of the people some of the time, some of the people all of the time, but you cannot fool all the people all of the time. - Abraham Lincoln
And suddenly a verbose and articulate newbie is the fountain of wisdom here who can spot the "phonies" in the community, something others who have known these people for as long as two decades could not do without your help? Do you take the same sage advice you are quick to dispense?
I understand your situation, but this is not about conformity. Showing a simple degree of respect to people who have been here a long time, and a willingness to listen to their own opinions when they happen to challenge you--which Butterfly Kisses did respectfully--is something to consider.
This is not a place for the weak of heart. It is anarchy in a way - only, not the greatest experience of it yet - a certain kind of happiness given the right amount of freedom has not been achieved. After you are welcomed in, you can easily be told indirectly to leave.
Thank you for telling us how this place works, CF. In my 20 years here, I never realized that until now. In all seriousness, if you do not want to feel unwelcome in an indirect way, then show a degree of respect to those who came before you and a willingness to listen as much as you dispense. Your opinions were listened to until you quickly showed an unwillingness to extend the same courtesies you expected. It's not our obligation to throw you the welcome mat, it's your obligation to show the community that you warrant it.
Trying to take sides upon arrival, I was cautious to do so, and now I find myself as a mere one-man army, and this place has quickly become like a battlefield of ideals.
As well as a place of mutual support and discussion, GC has always also been a place of debate. You need to consider that if you want to be comfortable here in expressing ideas.
Well, I'm not interested in war. I want a peace treaty. Everyone wins when there is peace. Too bad we all couldn't join forces soon enough.
Then show us respect, listen to what we have to say, and maybe we will eventually come to view you as the crusading leader and uniter that you seem to present yourself as. However, do not expect a community of MAPs who are predominantly pro-choice and youth-respecting to jump on the paternalism bandwagon. We have all had literally a lifetime to research and consider the mainstream view, and we have found it wanting for a reason.
I'm too damaged from this experience already. The long-standing members in charge around here should care more about everyone who joins.
If that is code for giving newbies a free pass on condescending attitudes and special deference to opinions that have never been overly popular in this segment of the community, then no. You are asking for something approaching entitlement rather than common courtesy.
That is how I would run this show, because it matters as this is all public information now.
"That is how I would run this show." That was a very telling but expected remark, and I too am glad this was made public. This should be heeded by all newbies for any type of community forum: do not start your time off in the new community by condescending and antagonistic behavior to the people who have paid their dues over a long period of years in the community, and telling them how it should be run. If you feel that way, then start your own community forum rather than trying to take over an established one.
Thanks at least for the welcome message, but it didn't end up being that warm for me.
Re-read your statement to Butterfly Kisses that prompted this response from me objectively, and then see why you ceased receiving warm responses. You need to give warmth and respect if you expect to receive it.
Anyway, I tried to bring some fresh ideas.
I appreciate what you had to say about the economic system. But paternalism and authoritarian views are not "fresh" around here. They have been discussed and largely rejected here for as long as GC has been around, which is 20 years and counting.
I hope someone new can do it better than me in the future, or there won't be anything good to look forward to here, except the same shit on a different day.
Meaning, it will never be to your liking. You are free to think that, of course, but pardon others if they beg to differ on the matter.