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Thank you for a fair response, and Re:

Posted by Dissident on Thursday, March 31 2022 at 00:54:59AM
In reply to Nice to see you back posted by Butterfly Kisses on Tuesday, March 29 2022 at 11:26:51PM

This all being said what I wrote about fully supporting Ukraine was before Zelensky shut down opposition political parties (supposedly just for the war, but I know freedom taken away is rarely recovered).

This puts you ahead of some people I've been debating with on this topic. The fact that people identifying with the Left can so callously throw aside these principles as soon as the war horn is blown and the patriotic instinct kicks in is a tendency of the modern mainstream Left that is very unsettling. This is why you see classical Marxists and classical Leftists like me siding with people on the "New" Right like Carlson, because despite my profound disagreements with the latter on economics we find common ground on supporting principles of freedom of speech and opposition to war for reasons related to profiteering. It truly is astounding and yes, amusing on some level as you noted, that I can no longer find common ground with people who purport to be compatriots on the Left. But I genuinely commend you on this, my friend.

If I were president Biden I would make any additional aid contingent on restoring the rights of those parties to exist. I would also demand a full investigation into abuse of Russian soldiers.

If you would do that, then you wouldn't be Biden, and the DNC would not allow you to win any primary election. Because in that case, you would be beholden to democratic principles rather than business as usual. And you would be required to demonize all Russian people as deserving nothing like humane treatment, otherwise you would be undermining the rationale for the sanctions which are going to hurt the Russian people far more than the people in office. Biden has even intimated that his strategy for those sanctions is to hurt the common people in Russia until they do something about Putin. That is the equivalent of me being a mob boss who is holding an enemy's mom captive and depriving her of food and water until she convinces her son to back off and do what I want him to do. And large segments of people in the neighborhood I control applauding me because they consider anyone related to my enemy to deserve being hurt and because I'm supposedly doing it for noble ends.

Though the second one does appear to be happening. Of course I'm not Biden and major media other than Fox News barely noted Zelensky shutting down those political parties.

Not reporting it was intended to save the many cheerleaders of the war having to come up with a rationalization for it like, "well, this is war, and you gotta do unfortunate things in war. Anything the government wants to do is gonna be a necessary evil. Blah blah blah..." Those alternative news sources who did report it are bastardized and called "conspiracy theorists" in both the mainstream media and on Wikipedia, so that takes care of that.

I still support Ukraine having a right to defend itself. I do not think Zelensky is acting alone here. I fully believe he has the support of at least over 50% of Ukrainians in not just rolling over and letting Russia do what it wants.

For now, yes. Well over 50% of the populace of any nation always supports its country when it goes to war. That tends to change after millions of people are killed and more than half of the country's infrastructure is destroyed, however. And once the realization sinks in that this horror could have been avoided by diplomatic actions that acceded to what were actually reasonable demands by a head of state, even a vicious nationalist like Putin.

If I were Ukrainian I would accept no NATO, but not demilitarization. Which is another demand of Russia's and the big one. If Ukraine has no army they can easily just be grabbed. But, that's just me.

Understandable and reasonable, but militarization of any nation would not be necessary if we, the masses, didn't continue to support the system we now live under. But yes, under the current state of affairs in the world, I do agree it would be unreasonable to expect any nation to completely dimilitarize itself, especially considering Russia and NATO alike would never agree to do so.

But, that's just me. I support the people of Ukraine to make any decision they want in regards to how they are ruled.

The thing is, the Ukrainian people were never asked. The heads of state make these decisions, and the opinion to push Zelensky into making this decision was "security advisors" from the USA government, not his people. And Zelensky is in office thanks to the USA, not thanks to his people. Even were that not so, our rulers have no obligation to follow the will of the people who elect these leaders. Note too how, as an example, Biden and his fellow Democrats that currently control Congress have refused to enact a single policy on his campaign platform despite the fact that over 80% of the common people want them in place. It doesn't matter if Biden was elected, because he owes nothing to the people who help elect him once he is granted that seat. The same goes for the Ukraine. Zelensky follows the will of the money, not the will of the Ukrainian people.


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